Panasonic BD60 vs BD80: Do I need multichannel analog outputs?

[textc3]

I just purchased the BD 60 and I am pissed to realize that it does not support Multichannel analog. The problem is my receiver is 5 yrs old Yamaha RX-V1400 and lacks HDMI. Should I send back and get the BD 80?

Honestly, what am I really giving up in having to connect the BD 60 to receiver via optical instead of multi-channel analog. Just spent a bunch of money on a 50 Panasonic plasma and I want good sound. However, I don't want to spend extra money on the BD 80 if I am not giving up much. As far as surround sound, will the optical cable still provide normal surround sound 5 channel that I am used to?

Thanks!!

[MrBoylan]

I just purchased the BD 60 and I am pissed to realize that it does not support Multichannel analog. The problem is my receiver is 5 yrs old Yamaha RX-V1400 and lacks HDMI. Should I send back and get the BD 80?

Honestly, what am I really giving up in having to connect the BD 60 to receiver via optical instead of multi-channel analog. Just spent a bunch of money on a 50 Panasonic plasma and I want good sound. However, I don't want to spend extra money on the BD 80 if I am not giving up much. As far as surround sound, will the optical cable still provide normal surround sound 5 channel that I am used to?

Thanks!!

Hi,

I moved this into a new thread. The BD80 does offer multi-channel analog output, a Playback information window, enhanced audio processing and isolating feet. Otherwise it and the BD60 are extremely similar. But the BD80 is very hard to find right now.

I've heard some of the larger dealers will get some BD80 stock before the end of the year, but probably not a lot. My suspicion is that Panasonic is going to be replacing the BD60 and BD80 with 3D-enabled versions early in 2010 (exactly how early in 2010 remains to be seen).

In terms of audio performance, the only way you can truly take advantage of DTS-HD MA, Dolby TrueHD and multi-channel PCM sound is with an HDMI-audio equipped receiver or multi-channel analog outputs/inputs. But setting up a player and receiver for multi-channel analog can be tricky. We have a tutorial on our site:

How To Set up a Blu-ray Player Using Multi-Channel Analog Outputs... And Why: BigPictureBigSound

Using the fiberoptic S/PDIF output of the BD60 instead will get you regular lossy surround sound. It is no worse than DVD (in fact, can be better in many cases), but it's a diminished version of the sound that Blu-ray is capable of. Whether it's enough of a difference in quality to merit the additional cost and set-up hassles of multi-channel analog is a personal question.

The only place where standard fiber/coax outputs are really *clearly* inferior to HDMI or multi-channel analog, even on modest systems is for multi-channel PCM soundtracks. These cannot be transmitted over S/PDIF digital connections (fiber/coax). They get down-mixed to stereo PCM output instead. There are over 300 Blu-ray titles with L-PCM soundtracks. Some of these are 2.0 so they don't matter. Some also have lossy Dolby Digital or DTS soundtracks, but not all.

So if you really want the best sound and want to keep your receiver, then get the Panasonic DMP-BD80, LG BD 390, OPPO BDP-83 or Samsung BD-P3600. But be prepared to spend some time tweaking things to get it right. A better option might be to keep the BD60, use the fiberoptic output for now and eventually upgrade the receiver to one that supports HDMI audio-decoding, like the Yamaha RX-V765:

Amazon.com: Yamaha RX-V765BL 665 Watt 7-Channel Home Theater Receiver: Electronics

It's similar in many ways to what you already have, but it supports HDMI audio/video processing which allows you to take full advantage of the losslesss surround codecs on Blu-ray Disc and still take advantage of the bass management and calibration options in the receiver.

Hope that helps.

-CB

[textc3]

Thanks for the explanation. I now need help with HDMI cables. I am inclined to purchase the expensive Monster HS 800HD HDMI cable. Does it really make a difference to spend so much on cables? Are there some less expensive brands/recommendations out there that do the job just as will for a lower price?

[MrBoylan]

Thanks for the explanation. I now need help with HDMI cables. I am inclined to purchase the expensive Monster HS 800HD HDMI cable. Does it really make a difference to spend so much on cables? Are there some less expensive brands/recommendations out there that do the job just as will for a lower price?

I have not been able to see any real differences between HDMI cables, except for bad (defective) cables that simply fail with visible sparklies, distortion or transmission errors.

What cable you buy is up to you, but I personally rarely spend more than $10-$12 on an HDMI cable. Recently, I've been using the Dayton brand HDMI cables from Parts Express, and buy them by the dozen to share with friends. They're currently around $4.00 each.

Analog cables (RCA component, and composite) vary more in quality than digital ones, in my experience. For those I'll normally go with a respected brand like Monster.

And don't buy the claims from some manufacturers that you need a higher bandwidth or "faster" HDMI cable to support 120 Hz or 240 Hz processing. These processing options are all in the display, not in the source.

-CB

[Steff3]

So if I have this right; no HDMI on receiver so best audio is, standard DVD's using fiber/coaxial with audio settings in the panny for both settings to bitstream and receiver to handle and if watching BluRay, anolog 5.1 set receiver to multi channel then audio settings in the Panny should be to PCM on both settings for the player to handle?

Since video is to TV via HDMI then the High Clarity is to off.

Is this correct?

[MrBoylan]

So if I have this right; no HDMI on receiver so best audio is, standard DVD's using fiber/coaxial with audio settings in the panny for both settings to bitstream and receiver to handle and if watching BluRay, anolog 5.1 set receiver to multi channel then audio settings in the Panny should be to PCM on both settings for the player to handle?

Since video is to TV via HDMI then the High Clarity is to off.

Is this correct?

Almost right but a couple of the details are off. Yes, use fiber or coax for DVDs and this will use the receiver's bass management, etc. And use the multi-channel analog outputs/inputs for Blu-ray Discs, with level settings and delays set in the player.

And if you like the sound of Blu-rays through the fiber/coax outputs, then by all means, listen to movies this way. Don't feel *compelled* to use the multi-channel inputs just because they're capable of delivering higher quality sound. But there is no need to set the digital audio output settings in the player differently for fiber/coax output vs. multi-channel analog outputs.
Bitstream" will work fine for both. The player will decode the lossless tracks to analog regardless of how "DTS" and "Dolby" are set in the menu.

Here are the settings you need:

• High Clarity Audio should be set to ON as this disables the analog video outputs, which you don't need if you are using the HDMI output for Video. This can clean up the sound by preventing any interference from the analog video processor.
  
• HDMI Audio should be set to OFF to prevent the TV from telling the player that it can't support multiple channels of audio. This will prevent you from getting any sound from the TV speakers but I assume this is what you want, right?
  
• In Digital Audio Outputs, Dolby should be set to BITSTREAM and DTS should be set to BITSTREAM, and BD-Secondary Audio should be set to OFF.
  
• Multi-channel analog outputs should be set to 2ch+5.1ch and you would just use the right-most group of multi-channel analog outputs on the player (unless you have a 7.1-channel system but I think you said you were 5.1, right?).

You'll need to click on that 2-ch+5.1-ch screen a second time to get into the speaker level and delay settings panel on the player. Also, keep in mind that the BD80 does not issue a test tone on the subwoofer channel (strange but true). You'll need to either use a calibration/test disc or set the subwoofer levels by ear using your favorite movies and music.

So were you able to pick up a BD80 then?

-CB

[Steff3]

Almost right but a couple of the details are off. Yes, use fiber or coax for DVDs and this will use the receiver's bass management, etc. And use the multi-channel analog outputs/inputs for Blu-ray Discs, with level settings and delays set in the player.

And if you like the sound of Blu-rays through the fiber/coax outputs, then by all means, listen to movies this way. Don't feel *compelled* to use the multi-channel inputs just because they're capable of delivering higher quality sound. But there is no need to set the digital audio output settings in the player differently for fiber/coax output vs. multi-channel analog outputs.
Bitstream" will work fine for both. The player will decode the lossless tracks to analog regardless of how "DTS" and "Dolby" are set in the menu.

Here are the settings you need:

• High Clarity Audio should be set to ON as this disables the analog video outputs, which you don't need if you are using the HDMI output for Video. This can clean up the sound by preventing any interference from the analog video processor.
  
• HDMI Audio should be set to OFF to prevent the TV from telling the player that it can't support multiple channels of audio. This will prevent you from getting any sound from the TV speakers but I assume this is what you want, right?
  
• In Digital Audio Outputs, Dolby should be set to BITSTREAM and DTS should be set to BITSTREAM, and BD-Secondary Audio should be set to OFF.
  
• Multi-channel analog outputs should be set to 2ch+5.1ch and you would just use the right-most group of multi-channel analog outputs on the player (unless you have a 7.1-channel system but I think you said you were 5.1, right?).

You'll need to click on that 2-ch+5.1-ch screen a second time to get into the speaker level and delay settings panel on the player. Also, keep in mind that the BD80 does not issue a test tone on the subwoofer channel (strange but true). You'll need to either use a calibration/test disc or set the subwoofer levels by ear using your favorite movies and music.

So were you able to pick up a BD80 then?

-CB

Thanks CB!! Yes you are correct on your questions, I do want HDMI Audio off (which I got right) and Secondary Audio off (which I got right). What I had wrong was the Clarity Audio and the Bitstream/PCM choice. The latter was the one really throwing me. I thought I read that for analog it needed to be to PCM but when I tried that I didn't sound right so I put it back to Bitstream and for standard DVD it sounded great. Was concerned about the sound on BD though but couldn't compare since I didn't have a BD disc to try. Yes, I found the BD80 at my local Best Buy. They actually had quite a few, probably upwards of 15 or so. They also gave me a decent price, considering the current supply and demand. 199.00 That was about 70.00 more then my Costco had the BD60 for but a lot cheaper than upgrading my receiver at the moment so I am happy. The picture quality is stunning on up converting now tonight I will try a BD. Thanks for all the great info. It helped immensely!!

[Steff3]

Please disregard, I had "A" speaker switch off. My apologies....

Well a bit of a problem . When I select multi channel on my receiver and use the proper settings as recommended on the player, I receive no front L/R, only center and rear. (

[MrBoylan]

Please disregard, I had "A" speaker switch off. My apologies....

Well a bit of a problem . When I select multi channel on my receiver and use the proper settings as recommended on the player, I receive no front L/R, only center and rear. (

Good thing it took me a few minutes to reply. I was going to suggest taking a flashlight to make sure you had plugged in the cables to the right outputs but your reason ("A" speakers switched off) is funnier.

-CB

[Diesel Pro]

I don't mean to hijack here, but I am on a similar quest. I also have a non HDMI Yamaha RXV-3300.

I followed the notes above but cannot seem to get any sound from the 5.1 analog.

When I run the optical cable for audio I just get center channel.

Using my old panasonic DVD player I get my surround.

Any suggestions?